A New Revelation

[GT40FIED]

Ok...so I'm a little drunk and I've been watching "Night Of The Living Dead", but I've had this revelation. I was watching the original 50's version of this movie and thinking about the remade version I grew up with (made in the '80s). Now, in the original version people became zombies as a result of radiation due to a satellite crash. In the remake, however, (and all of it's subsiquent sequals) the cause was blamed on government created viruses. So here's my revelation...when did we as a country become so mistrusting of the goverment that we decided to change the endings of classic movies? I mean honsetly...think of how many movies you've seen where the government engineered a virus that killed people/altered people's state of mind. In the 50's and 60's is was always radioactivity or alien crap. Have we really become that jaded (or clear headed)?

[jjcivic92]

I've never thought about that. You're right though - no doubt. That's pretty interesting though. When did we start thinking like that? "Crazyness."

Yeah that is pretty weird. Something to ask the parents about. I would venture to say its a number of things. I would say anywhere from Nixon's watergate scandal to those conspiracy guys saying the moon landing was a hoax and the Roswell dealy and even when the government dropped some sort of chemical on San Francisco (but probably not that cuz that recently got out). Probably just a number of things like that that made people see that the government doesn't necessarily have our best interests in mind and that they are hiding things from us (I'm not necessarlily complaining, I'm sure they're doing some wacky stuff that I don't want to know about).

Speaking of stuff being hidden from the general public, a friend of mine worked at this one place that had all of these different divisions. He had to deliver a message from one part of the place to another. So, he was going to deliver it and got a bit lost after taking a wrong turn. As he was going down this hallway there was this security door infront of him that a doctor was going through. The doctor just held the door for him, so my friend went on through. Past the security door on the side of the hall there was this glass window leading to another room and in that room he saw this transparent monkey. He said the closest thing he could think of to describe it (the transparency)was that it was kind of like the thing from predator. Right after he saw the monkey some doctor comes up to him and is like, "Hey what do you think you're doing?" My friend told him he got lost and this guy held the door for him. The doctor asked him if he saw anything. My friend told him no, then the doctor just told him to get out of there because he was trespassing and lucky the doctor didn't have him arrested. The doctor then gave him directions to where he needed to go. When he got back he told his boss about what he saw. His boss just said, "Yeah, they do some pretty crazy s**t down there."

That got a little off topic maybe, but thats my theory as to why movies started painting the government in a bad light.

[Kyle]

Originally posted by Loki

Speaking of stuff being hidden from the general public, a friend of mine worked at this one place that had all of these different divisions. He had to deliver a message from one part of the place to another. So, he was going to deliver it and got a bit lost after taking a wrong turn. As he was going down this hallway there was this security door infront of him that a doctor was going through. The doctor just held the door for him, so my friend went on through. Past the security door on the side of the hall there was this glass window leading to another room and in that room he saw this transparent monkey. He said the closest thing he could think of to describe it (the transparency)was that it was kind of like the thing from predator. Right after he saw the monkey some doctor comes up to him and is like, "Hey what do you think you're doing?" My friend told him he got lost and this guy held the door for him. The doctor asked him if he saw anything. My friend told him no, then the doctor just told him to get out of there because he was trespassing and lucky the doctor didn't have him arrested. The doctor then gave him directions to where he needed to go. When he got back he told his boss about what he saw. His boss just said, "Yeah, they do some pretty crazy s**t down there."

That got a little off topic maybe, but thats my theory as to why movies started painting the government in a bad light.

i'm gonna have to call out the flag on that ...your friend was probably just making something up

Originally posted by Kyle
i'm gonna have to call out the flag on that ...your friend was probably just making something up

I'll join that pickett line.

Seriously, even first-hand accounts of what goes on are so often totall People like to tell stories, and what's better than a good conspiracy story or another one of the "guess what the government is doing" stories?

Not to mention the disparity between what is perceived and what actually exists. Considering that memories can be "implanted" in people, you can never fully trust everything a person remembers.

But if you see it on TV, it must be true.

GT40FIED: I think it's been an evolving process from a lot of little steps. As long as I've been growing up I think people in general just don't trust the government. I'm not sure how far that goes back. But the government hasn't often operated truly in the best interest of the public, they operate in the interest of getting votes. The very nature of how politics works is contradictory to trustworthiness. Also the very secrecy of government is contradictory to trustworthiness. But that's not to say the secrecy isn't always for the benefit of the public, sometimes it really is. Other times....it's not.

I just got Return of the Living Dead....haven't wathced it yet. Haven't seen Night.... yet either.

b

[ebpda9]

well regarding the trust in the government and hiding secrets from the genaral public: take the russwell ( or whatever you spell it) case: did u really need a general paranoia around that the aliens are invading us ? do u want the military secrets out so the enemy knows what to expect ? i think most time in a war the element of surprise is the difference between winning or losing the war. you don't want your enemy to find out your secrets, so he starts developing the same technology as you. Yeah i know it's all a matter of politics and some of the things are better left unknown to the general public.

and i think hollywood just likes to feed peoples fears. The change in the end with the man made viruses i think has something to do with the somewhat recent cases of anthrax and biologycal weapons in Iraq.

Originally posted by hondaman-iac
do u want the military secrets out so the enemy knows what to expect ? i think most time in a war the element of surprise is the difference between winning or losing the war. you don't want your enemy to find out your secrets, so he starts developing the same technology as you.

And it's Roswell.

It always troubles me when I see these idiots (i.e. Newsweek) posting stories of how the public has a right to know everything that goes on at Area 51. C'mon, how freakin stupid are those morons? "Hey, let's tell the American public what secret weapons and technologies we're developing to protect the homeland....don't worry, no enemies will find out about it and take advantage of it."

b

Originally posted by Kyle
i'm gonna have to call out the flag on that ...your friend was probably just making something up

hehe, yeah probably. But I'm gullible.

Originally posted by spoogenet
I just got Return of the Living Dead....haven't wathced it yet. Haven't seen Night.... yet either.

b

Sorry, I don't mean to post a bunch of crap in a row. I replied to the one thing and didn't really read the other posts and had a question about this quote. Is Return of the Living Dead the one in the shopping mall or is that Dawn of the Dead or am I just off completly? There's so many 'of the dead movies its hard to keep them straight.

[nonovurbizniz]

I'm gunna guess the motiviation for all the movies about gov. making/testing virus' are based on the gov. making/testing virus' on people...

Origianally the tuskegee experiment...

For forty years between 1932 and 1972, the U.S. Public Health Service (PHS) conducted an experiment on 399 black men in the late stages of syphilis. These men, for the most part illiterate sharecroppers from one of the poorest counties in Alabama, were never told what disease they were suffering from or of its seriousness. Informed that they were being treated for “bad blood,”1 their doctors had no intention of curing them of syphilis at all. The data for the experiment was to be collected from autopsies of the men, and they were thus deliberately left to degenerate under the ravages of tertiary syphilis—which can include tumors, heart disease, paralysis, blindness, insanity, and death. “As I see it,” one of the doctors involved explained, “we have no further interest in these patients until they die.”

Then there were LOTS of stuff with the gov. testing drugs and especially vaccines on the inlisted men...

I'm sure all the roswell and other gov. coverups have helped along the way... it's pretty obvious to just about everyone that the gov.'s of EVERY country including our own are corrupt and up to no good... if it's at our expense or results directly in harm to us it doesn't matter to them unless it'll affect their grip on power.

i really think of it as a state of the less i know the better off i am

i would wave the bs flag initally. but, there is invisible camoflauge, it was on weapons of the future on discovery channel last month. They covered a tank in it, and drove it through the desert with recon searching for it and they couldnt find it.

[GT40FIED]

Originally posted by Loki
Sorry, I don't mean to post a bunch of crap in a row. I replied to the one thing and didn't really read the other posts and had a question about this quote. Is Return of the Living Dead the one in the shopping mall or is that Dawn of the Dead or am I just off completly? There's so many 'of the dead movies its hard to keep them straight.

Shopping Mall = Dawn of the Dead. Great movie. Sorry...I love horror movies...especially gorey and bad ones. Evil Dead I & II and Army of Darkness own me.

I agree with Spooge...we don't have a right to know what goes on at the Area 51 testing grounds, but I'd appreciate it if they'd at least acknowledge that it's THERE and quit treating the public like total morons. The Roswell thing is f@cked up too. The Air Force has released three different reports that state 3 different explanations. The last one stated that it was a weather balloon crash that they'd loaded with 6' tall human dummies. WTF? There's no concievable reason that they'd need human dummies on a weather balloon. Plus it was 50 years ago and I think we're all jaded enough to conclude that something did indeed happen. Then again when you're shoulder deep in a lie it's considered bad form to actually tell the truth. It also seems a bit suspicious that we had a HUGE surge of technology shortly after that...most of which were developed by the same departments that made the recovery. The most often named technologies attributed to that crash are integrated circuits, night vision, superconductors, and even microwave ovens. It's all just a bunch of blatant

[ebpda9]

yeah, but then again, if they aknowledge the area 51 is gonna draw a lot of pulbilc there and i am sure they do not want that.

[GT40FIED]

Dood...have you seen documentaries about that place? You can't get within miles of it before armed guards meet you. They've got fences, motion sensors, and all kinds of advanced security and surveilance. Plus it's restricted air space and it's illegal to make satallite photographs of it. I don't think they've got anything to worry about as far as secrects go.

i saw that invisible camo thing, albeit not involving the tank. THe one i saw, i think it was on tech tv, showed this new fabric some company was develping that defracted the light in a special way, you could almost see through the girl's abdomen.

Originally posted by GT40FIED
Plus it's restricted air space and it's illegal to make satallite photographs of it.

That's the one that cracks me up the most. It's illegal for AMERICANS to take satellite photos of it....other countries can do what they want. Hehe.....gotta love the government.

I could go either way on the technology thing. Sure if you're exposed to something with advanced technology it can allow you discover or otherwise invent new technologies in a big leap. However at the same time technology can develop in huge leaps on its own. Every now and then something huge comes out of a research project, sometimes by accident, that revolutionizes things.

What boggles my mind much more than some of our recent technological innovations are those of the ancient civilizations. The precision of the pyramids is mind boggling, the precision and accuracy of ancient mathematics relating not just to worldly things, but cosmic things as well. Is man's fascination with the cosmos perhaps based in something deeper than human curiosity and fascination with the unkown?

Perhaps the Earth was visited a long time ago? Perhaps life started on Earth from a seed of another planet? Chances are the world will never know, but it's interesting to think about.

b

[GT40FIED]

Sounds like someone besides me watches Tuesday declassified on the Sci-Fi channel. The ancient civilization thing is very true. If you look back, ancient Summarians had extremely detailed maps of the solar system around 6000BC. Our own "detailed" maps didn't pop up until the late 19th/early 20th century. They also have documents written in cuneiform (sp?) that talk about an ancient race of people known as the Annunahki (again, sp?) that came here and basically started life on earth as genetic experiments. Weird.

I remember seeing a program on Discovery (remember, if it's on TV, it's gotta be true) talking about this one tribe in Africa who had some cave drawings from waaaay back in the day. I forget how far back, but I believe BC at least. Anyways, they basically had a drawing of the solar system with relative sizings of the planets, correct order, etc. except for 1 thing....a 10th planet. They had some kind of a name for it, don't remmeber if it was dark planet, or what for that one and it's drawn beyond Pluto. They drew things indicating that life descended from that planet. Supposedly (according to this show) there's been some recent (like mid-to-late 90's) research suggesting a 10th planet, Planet X as they call it. I thought it was interesting....ancient tribes claiming we are descendents of another planet. Supposedly the tribe also still does rituals to this day celebrating the dawn of life on Earth.

b

Wow, one of the recent really interesting posts on HST that's I've read. Probably one of the best to date. You come up with good topic GT40! Honestly, I love all this conspiracy theory stuff too, and I believe that to some degree it has to be true because, well, something as complicated as life and all the physical, checmical and biological laws that let us live our lives on Earth, should not be a simple explanation of "it all started from the big bang."
I personally believe that aliens and God probably have something in common, just that the media shows the two very different forms, aliens commonly known as little green creatures, and religious people shown in "saint like" forms. Anyways, once I get more time, I'll add a more detailed reply. Nice post once again...

[GT40FIED]

Originally posted by spoogenet
I remember seeing a program on Discovery (remember, if it's on TV, it's gotta be true) talking about this one tribe in Africa who had some cave drawings from waaaay back in the day. I forget how far back, but I believe BC at least. Anyways, they basically had a drawing of the solar system with relative sizings of the planets, correct order, etc. except for 1 thing....a 10th planet. They had some kind of a name for it, don't remmeber if it was dark planet, or what for that one and it's drawn beyond Pluto. They drew things indicating that life descended from that planet. Supposedly (according to this show) there's been some recent (like mid-to-late 90's) research suggesting a 10th planet, Planet X as they call it. I thought it was interesting....ancient tribes claiming we are descendents of another planet. Supposedly the tribe also still does rituals to this day celebrating the dawn of life on Earth.

b

Actually, that's the Summarians right there (though I'm not sure they were African...but maybe). They believed that the Annunahki (do I really need to keep saying I'm not sure of the spelling?) came from that 10th planet which, in actuality, is there. It's often refered to as a moon of pluto but there IS a 10th celestial object beyond Pluto. It's just that nobody can agree on what to call it. Now...how a civilization knew this 8000 years before us "modern" folk is almost incomprehensible without the help of someone with far advanced technology. What really worries me is the accuracy of these things. Particularly Mayans. Their calender (which is far more accurate than our and was created much earlier) ends in 2012. Just plain stops. Also...it's kinda messed up what you find digging through tombs...below is (hopefully...assuming I don't f@ck up the link) is a picture traced from a carving in Mayan ruins. Kinda looks like a guy piloting a rocket, no?

I don't know much about the Sumarians, so it could have been the same people. Although this program was talking about them still being around in this little remote place in Africa. It's been a while since I've seen it, so it's a big IIRC and I might be butchering it a little.

That picture looks more to me like man's first attempt at VR sex. Sorry he just has a goofy look on his face.

Yeah the Mayan calendar is a pretty interesting one......but I wouldn't be surprised if the world "ended" in 2012 considering the way things are going right now *cough* Dubya *cough*. Ok, so there's far more awry with the world right now than what's in his control.

Collectively throughout the world we've been in a downward spiral socially, culturally, and ecologically for many years now.

b

Dubya?

[GT40FIED]

Our current president...George W. (Dubya) Bush. You know...cuz he's retarded and can't speak properly.

I actually heard a few years ago in a science class that astronomers found two planets beyond pluto however they were revolving around a different sun. Of course they would have to be WAAAYYY beyond pluto since pluto is way out there and still revolves around our sun. I haven't heard of the pluto moon thing or life coming from it. That's really quite fascinating. Too bad we don't have better record of it.

Yeah the discovery of planets in other solar systems is a somewhat recent trend in astronomy. But a lot more than 2 have been discovered now. It was a pretty big deal when the first discoveries started to come in. Due to the fact the method of discovery was new, it caused lots of astronomers to revisit other stars and find evidence of planets there.

Looking at your own solar system can be more difficult. The basic analogy is that if you stand in one place, or even one room of your house, you can see a lot more of your neighborhood and the insides of other peoples' houses than you can see in your own.

b

Is that how you spy on that hot cutie always changing next door? God dammit brother, I think I'm going to start doing the same now!

[ebpda9]

Originally posted by spoogenet


That picture looks more to me like man's first attempt at VR sex. Sorry he just has a goofy look on his face.

LMAO

Originally posted by spoogenet

Yeah the Mayan calendar is a pretty interesting one......but I wouldn't be surprised if the world "ended" in 2012 considering the way things are going right now *cough* Dubya *cough*. Ok, so there's far more awry with the world right now than what's in his control.

I thought those were the azteks (not the gm cars lol), but with my hystorical knowledge it's hard to remeber things.

Originally posted by spoogenet

Collectively throughout the world we've been in a downward spiral socially, culturally, and ecologically for many years now.

b

true that. I think most of the research now it's being conducted more for the money rather than the development of the world. It's just a personal oppinion. And lately it seems that everyone is interested with it's own personal being than with a collective being. I wish times would change but i guess you can call me a hypocrite for that. Sometimes i see only my own interests and don't give a hoot about someone else, but luckily for me that happens very rare.

and gt40fied regarding the innacuracies in today's world: i think it's all because of the technology. It sure feels great to have technology by your side when doing research but it is not fool proof. How many times have you seen the last digits rounded in mathematical expressions ? i still think the human brain is the smartest so far, and no technology it's going to replace it's accuracy and power anytime soon, althou i fear the day when that will happen.

that was really ot now

i refuse to accept the idea beings from another planet coming to our solar system and helping create the human race, nor do i believe in some almighty being is behind all of this. Take a basic biology and physics course and you'll understand why this stuff sounds like fairytales. That's not really a rant though, just an opinion. I will admit the ancient civilizations were extremely educated in scientific and mathematic matters. Probably because they killed all of the "dubya's" lol

[ebpda9]

Originally posted by 93Honda
i refuse to accept the idea beings from another planet coming to our solar system and helping create the human race, nor do i believe in some almighty being is behind all of this. Take a basic biology and physics course and you'll understand why this stuff sounds like fairytales. That's not really a rant though, just an opinion. I will admit the ancient civilizations were extremely educated in scientific and mathematic matters. Probably because they killed all of the "dubya's" lol

i don't know how old are you or where you go to school, but in my physics class the teacher already told us that there are some things that happen and they cannot be explained thru regular or quantum physics

[GT40FIED]

I'll second that. I'm not saying one way or the other that we were created or by whom, but It's a bit naive to think that "primitive" people could've looked into the sky at night and drawn detailed maps of our solar system. Where do you think they got that information? Guessing? I know it's a tall order, but there are just some things that science can't explain away and that's where logic takes over.

i love how i state that it's my "OPINION", thus of my own thought, i was not forcing it onto anyone, and what happens, "I don't know how old you are," man i wish i could have my integrity insulted by admins more often when stating my opinion. What i meant by basic physics is that to reach the earth would take way to much time. It's known that you can't travel at the speed of light. Don't say teleportation cause someone here presented that picture of the mayan with the rocket strapped to his rear end. But anyways it doesn't really matter, Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. That is just what i think. Sure there is a lot of unexplained stuff, i'm just saying you don't have to automatically jump to god or aliens to provide answers to those problems. People used to say god controlled the weather, and we know now that that is just not the case. Given time science can answer any question.

[GT40FIED]

I hear what you're saying and I didn't mean to imply that you were wrong. We're all just throwing around theories and opinions here, none of which are fact or right or wrong. They're just ideas. I will say this...while Einstein stated that faster than light travel is forbidden by the laws of physics, it may still be possible to manipulate those laws (like in Event Horizon...bitchin movie btw). Besides...if a civilization had been around for say...a thousand years before us, I think it's safe to assume they'd be far more advanced than we are. Hell...all of our serious technological advances have come within the last hundred years or so (give or take a century). And that's assuming said civilization uses the same brain capacity we do (which is what....like 4%?). I dunno...there's just too much weird shit out there to explain it all with science IMO.

ya, that does have some relevance behind it. Oh the 4% is only half true. If you think about it each area is delegated to certain areas. 10% here 10% there. Now if you use 4% for talking they may be all that is allotted to speech, thus you may only be using 4% but you're using 100% of the speech area.

Originally posted by 93Honda
i love how i state that it's my "OPINION", thus of my own thought, i was not forcing it onto anyone, and what happens, "I don't know how old you are," man i wish i could have my integrity insulted by admins more often when stating my opinion. What i meant by basic physics is that to reach the earth would take way to much time. It's known that you can't travel at the speed of light. Don't say teleportation cause someone here presented that picture of the mayan with the rocket strapped to his rear end. But anyways it doesn't really matter, Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. That is just what i think. Sure there is a lot of unexplained stuff, i'm just saying you don't have to automatically jump to god or aliens to provide answers to those problems. People used to say god controlled the weather, and we know now that that is just not the case. Given time science can answer any question.

Yeah everybody knows that god doesn't controll the weather. It's whether or not you left the sunroof open.

I didn't learn anything in physics or biology that in any way denied the possibility of an alien culture visiting the Earth. Based upon what we think we know about history and evolution, I doubt whether any alien culture helped create humans....however why couldn't they have simply visited?

I think there's the possibility that life on Earth perhaps got its start as a seed from another world. I consider it just as likely as it starting by its own on Earth. That's not to say it was a seed sent by anybody, but it could have come from elsewhere. And it may have just started in the proverbial primordial soup.

There are so many fascinating things about some of the ancient human cultures that we have yet to explain. Scholars still debate to this day the exact way the pyramids were built. The precision with which they were built and the incredible feats that were overcome by the technology we're aware of them having are astounding. The shear weight of the blocks uses is immense, it's just amazing.

Considering their fascination with the heavens, the precision and magnitude of their engineering accomplishments with relation to the heavens, and some of their visual representations of the gods.....I think it's entirely possible the Earth was perhaps visited by elsewhere.

I don't really believe one way or the other that Earth was visited, I'm just saying I wouldn't be surprised if it was....or wasn't.

Edit: I wouldn't have such blind faith in science. Given time some questions are much more difficult to answer. While science is powerful, it is also weak. It is limited by the imagination and capabilities of the human mind to realize, comprehend, understand, and discover. Often times many areas of science only develop further upon chance discovery of something. Whether science would have developed in the same way without the discovery, given time, will never be known.

b

[ebpda9]

Originally posted by 93Honda
"I don't know how old you are," man i wish i could have my integrity insulted by admins more often when stating my opinion. What i meant by basic physics is that to reach the earth would take way to much time. It's known that you can't travel at the speed of light. Don't say teleportation cause someone here presented that picture of the mayan with the rocket strapped to his rear end. But anyways it doesn't really matter, Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. That is just what i think. Sure there is a lot of unexplained stuff, i'm just saying you don't have to automatically jump to god or aliens to provide answers to those problems. People used to say god controlled the weather, and we know now that that is just not the case. Given time science can answer any question.

sorry i didn't mean to insult anyone with my comment. i wasn't sure if you were in college or not, because my phisics teacher--an older hippie-- really explained to us some stuff that sent chills down my spine

Originally posted by hondaman-iac
sorry i didn't mean to insult anyone with my comment. i wasn't sure if you were in college or not, because my phisics teacher--an older hippie-- really explained to us some stuff that sent chills down my spine

Like what?

The quantum mechanics of smoke being released from a burning roach?

b

[GT40FIED]

Random post of the day (seeing as how I'm the one who started this hooplah): If I could live my life on the TV...I wanna be on the X Files!

spoogenet, ya but my physics teacher screwed with my head the first day. We got on the subject of matter not being able to be created or destroyed, " That's not entirely true, in blacks hole matter can pop in and out of existence," of corse that shattered all scientific reasoning i had lol.