[VR4_Craver]

Originally Posted by Robert

Let me touch on both topics here raised at once.




Just like I am being blamed of sweeping statements, you two are making huge generalities on the issue which are not fact. The reality is a small percentage of people abuse the system and ruin it for others. It is these people you see mostly. Secondly the few blacks that have money do not represent the majority. The majority do not live the lives you speak of. When you live a life where you're bumbarded by news media telling you to act gangstar and live like a thug tell me you'd be different. If you do you're a fool. We are all products of our envoirnment and are influenced by what we see/taught while young.

There are however a huge number of people, in Cali estimated 1 million illegal workers working for cash and living lives. These people never qualify for the services you saw covered.

Will there always be people who take advantage of the system? Yes, of course. However they will be of all race and color, it is in peoples nature to be like this.

However the tone given above is boarderline on racial, they aren't dumb because they had a 4th child. There is no where in the law that dictates the level of income required to have a child. If the coin was flipped on you, one could say at your income you shoulndt be having a child. Minority or not. I think you're racist.

Steve, good points. Watch the doc. I suggested. In this areas I am probably more educated on the influences of media and racial descrimination then you are. Trust me when I tell you the comments I have made are not without fact. I however will leave it up to your interest and smarts to discover these on your own.

Start with these...
http://www.mediachannel.org/ownership/chart.shtml
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...s/cool/giants/
More in racisim
http://weeklywire.com/ww/09-14-98/nash_film-video.html
http://www.medialit.org/reading_room/article384.html
http://www.mediachannel.org/ownership/chart.shtml
http://www.yale.edu/ypq/articles/oct99/oct99b.html

There is a tone to learn and there is more out there. Do your research, learn and then develope and opinion greater then your limited personal experience. That IMO is the only way to prevent yourself from becoming ignorant of fact.

My "tone" was far from being racist. Yes I did point out facts. Unless what I witness myself is no longer considered fact. I guess I should be considered racist if I get pissed off about someone living off the money I bust my ass each day to have taken out in taxes, so they can have more kids and live a better life then I do. The argument here was that blacks and mexicans are being labeled as gangsters by the media, therefore live that kind of life style. Yet, 4 out of the 6 sources you mention have something to do with the media. Its like watching the weather on your 6 o'clock news and seeing rain the next 3 days then going onto the website and seeing sunshine and high of 90. Completely contradictory. Also, I am the fool for letting others tell me how I am gonna turn out? No. The fool is the one who listens to people who are paid to create controversy like that to get ratings. There is no coin flip needed robert I dont make nearly enough to give my son the kind of life I want him to live. So using your "coin" logic I should just give up and live off of welfare my whole life and never strive to achieve anything.

As far as the research goes:

http://www.in.gov/fssa/family/welfare/welfare.html
Look at that one for Indiana.
http://www.oas.samhsa.gov/2k2/GovAid/GovAid.htm
this one to show that while on goverment assitance Substance abuse rose.
http://www.house.gov/pence/rsc/gov_waste.shtml
and on that one you can download .pdf's showing Medicaid and Food Stamp Waste/Abuse.