New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

the jetta waswither a 1.8t or a vr6....i think it was a vr6 tho...

I was going home after i dropped a friend off, and i was passing a side street, and comeing out of it, was a new jetta. He turned out, and followed me for a while til i got onto a four lane main rode (two for each direction). he was on my tail close and THats when i dropped it into second and floored it. He did the same. I was suprised at how well my car did, i staye ed ahead of him for about 1/4 mile. Then slowed it down, and waited, he was still pulln on me, and still comin, so when he was about a car away from my bumper, i shifted to second again, and gunned it, altho it took me a sec to start pulln hard, and by then he was even, and slowely pulled away til his rear bumper was at my front, and we went like this for a long ass time! then we both shut it down, and he gave me a nod of approval....after we were even again, i tapped the gass a few times quickely to taunt, and then jsut plain floored it. he did too, adn as soon as i was about a car or two ahead, we evened out, and no one pulled at all....

so i think are cars were about even on the fast-o-meter...so eya, good fun race...i'm suprised at how well my car did. Civic power!!...:paranoid:

alright I hate that I have to be the one to do this... but...

COME ON... that was a NA 1.8... DEFINATELY not a 1.8T and DEFINATELY not a vr6... if it was either they would've SMOKED you with a type R swap...

vr6's are FAST... REALLY REALLY FAST... 1.8t's are quick... the na 1.8's are crap boxes that run about as fast as a 1.6vtec engine with .2 more liters.

if I'm wrong good job I guess... but... you'd have to have nitrous to beat a vr6 with a mildly competent driver.

Are you not sure which one it was cuz there were no markings on the back... if so... that's cuz it's the 1.8 na... they're the un-marked ones... the 1.8t and vr6 are both PROMINANTLY badged as such.

Its was probably a crap box 2.0L..:bandit:

^ya... that one... the 1.8t and vr6 are FAST. there's NO way a stock or even built 1.6 D series would have so much as a chance against one of them.

People under estimate civics a lot, and i think you're one of the people that does....i have a 30k mile engine, and you have what? you have a 1995 civ right? that thing prolly has a lot more than 80k miles on it, no? thats why oyu think civics are UTTERLY AND COMPLETELY SLOW....read my post shifting gears....

dude... my car isn't slow... it's slow compared to a fast car like a vr6...

and also it has 155k but I GUARANTEE it's pulling not a drop less hp then it was stock.

my engine runs great and in certain gears I can put up a fight with some stuff. And I can beat tons of cars on the road... cuz most people don't RACE... and a LOT of those who do don't know how... AND because my car is faster than some cars... most of which are civics and full of kids who think their car is fast.

My "estimation" of a civic needs NO work... your grip with reality does though... it's just not a fast car man...

here are some simple questions if you think your car is fast...

can you pull your head off of the headrest when your flooring it?
-NO

Do your tires break loose when you floor it in anygear? much less 3rd or 4th.
-NO maybe in first (but I HIGHLY doubt it... no can you do a burnout... if your rolling do the tires break loose when you floor it.)
Do you do 0-60 in sub 5 sec?
-DEFINATELY not

are your 1/4 mi. times under or even within (I'll be generous) 14?
-NO F'ing WAY

If not... (just to let you know you can't answer ANY of those questions with a yes) your car is NOT fast...

what are your 60-80 times? in any gear much less top.

I'm not saying your car is retarded. I'm not saying it's the slowest car out there... what I'm saying is that if your beating v6's it is ALL driver... both your good driving and their TERRIBLE driving.

If you had a robot drive your car and his... his will be faster EVERY time... that's all there is to it.

congrats on the kill and all... but come back to earth.


OK here...

your car stock does a 17 sec. 1/4 mi

a stock vr6 is around 15-16... so your saying that your exhaust (a pacesetter I might mention) took 2 seconds off your quater mile time?

Lets pretend that's true... then your saying that a 15sec quater mile time is good... or as you say... FAST?... uh sure.

again dude... I'm not trying to rip on you... but it was all driver if you beat a vr6... it's not your supercivic.

Seriously Opak.. Theres nothing to under estimate about a civic.. They arent all that. :no: My car doesnt feel any slower at 75K miles then it did at 20K. I have a few friends that are into VWs big time! And I can tell you, a solid VR6 with a good driver will smear a D16 with a good driver. So either that Vr6 wasnt running right, or the driver wasnt running it right. Who knows. But the fact of the matter is VR6s, while they arent the most powerful motors on the road they will put a good whipping on a D16 engine thats been lightly moded.

Ya I got mine at 60k or so... and it runs MUCH better now then it did then... that's half of what's good about civic's they're reliable and run well even with TONS of miles...

speed is DEFINATELY not one of there selling points.

Alls i know is that when engines get older, they get more worn, and their piston rings get worn, and some other stuff, they lose compression, and lose power....i just swaped another stock civ engine into my car, cause my other one was leaking oil and the oil light doesn't work, so it ran outta oil, and well....ca-boom! ...yea, so now i ahve my enw one, and its 2 times faster...and its not the new muffler i put on it(Tsudo muffler off their Fireball system). And i've talked to a few guys who know their stuff on honda engines, and they said that HP decreases as the engine gets older.

And BTW, WHo the hell has a car that you can't pull your head off the headrest when flooring it? you can pull your head off the rest in a McLaren. Alls i know is that the guy i raced was impressed....so yea:yes: ;)

well someone did their homework, I have an accord and I'm proud to say I'm slow
woooh go me
but I've beaten a few civics

Engines normally (ESPECIALLY the honda motors) dont start to lose power until reaching the 160k+ mile mark.. Even then, with regular maintenence, true, some parts are going to get worn. Its a pretty easy job to replace those parts and get the desired "power" back.

But we arent exactly talking about engine life. An out of the factory d16 would still not hang with a vr6... I think he forgot to depress the gas pedal

you are correct.. i have a juiced lightly modded d16y8 and barely beat a 1.8t on a 50 shot...

this opakracing kid is full of shit.. on his BEST day he has a low 16 sec car..

Ifit was possible, i would give you the phone number of the cop, and or if you were coming here, i would have you meet up with him, to have him tell you what happened....you know nothing if you think this story is bullshit.


i dunno how much it matters, but i had my interioir stripped, and on that night, i had no speaker box in the back, and i notice the difference...if i could prove it to you, i would...but you're no where near me.

i know a guy with an integra ls 1991, that beats type r's, and he only ahs an intake on it....its jsut a freak teg...faster than usual, no one can guess why the hell he beats type r's....the reason i kept up,is prolly a mix between driver and a light quick civic.

what cop.. what the hell are you talking about.. you just lost me there... and id rather meet up with you are race.. but as you stated you are far too far away..




i can answer that question for you.. you MIGHT on a PERFECT day knocked a tenth of a second off your time... and speeker boxes don't come stock SSSOOOOOO you are JUST making it closer to stock weight.. and SLIGHTLY lighter... and im sure your car was not "stripped"



you are dillusional you will NOT notice a tenth.. you just THINK its faster..

meet you half way?

:rolleyes:


1994 - Acura Integra LS 16.0
1997 Acura Integra Type R 15.1

from my findings and my own knowledge from what ive seen at the track the type R is a VERY low 15 sec car stock... and the ls is VERY VERY VERY high 15's more likely low 16's car.. there is ABSOLUTELY NO WAY IN HELL that a STOCK ls with intake will beat a STOCK type R unless the drivers of the "type r's" implying that it has beaten more than one on more than one occasion are ALL complete idiots...



more and more and more BS.. boy is it filling up..

your car is not quick.. 16 seconds is not quick.. and your car is far from light.. a crx hf is light your car MAY be light compared to like a camaro or something.. but in OUR world.. the ej civic is NOT very light

What is the HF CRX missing again? I know it's missing something that makes it so much lighter than the others.

EVERYTHING.. it basicly comes with NOTHING and a whopping 78 hp i think its like 78.. lmfao it has NO power anything no air conditioning no power steering.. "it don't got shit" lol;)

i forget EXACTLY what it doesn't have but those are a few of the things.. its a CHEAP light no features "econobox" in the truest sense of the word

my old sentra was a similar factory strip like the hf... they have no power ANYTHING... my sentra didn't come with a stock stereo.. not even am/fm...

opak... your car is NOT light... it weighs WAY over 2500 lbs... that is HEAVY..

the ex is the HEAVIEST civic out there... I believe the ek is even heavier than the eg...

I don't think it's bs... I think you don't realize that if it weren't all bad driving/running car on his part you wouldn't have won.

you may have beat a vr6... just not w/o help from a CRAPPY driver on the other end.. that or his engine or tranny are shot.

there is just simply NO way... it's NOT POSSIBLE. I know you're going to take that as even more proof as to how badass your car is but your wrong...

you drive an under-powered HEAVY car... not a super fast light one.

Quote: from nonovurbizniz
"opak... your car is NOT light... it weighs WAY over 2500 lbs... that is HEAVY."

oh smart ingenious one....lmao the civic weighs STOCK 2262 curb weight. He gutted the back of the car and didnt have his box in at the time so it DEFINITELY isnt over 2500. Considering the facts it is actully fairly light. Get your s*** straight before you start hating.

alright there big guy... is that the weight of an EX which is the HEAVIEST civic made... even if it is... that's still the HEAVIEST civic made. Not exactly a "lightweight"

He "gutted the back of his car" huh??? so he took out the spare and a box... I'm guessing the spare was still there with the jack and tools which ALL individually weigh more than the rest of the "trunk"... so he pulled out a 30lb box (returning it to STOCK weight) and MAYBE 2lbs of cardboard (spare cover) and 1lb or 2 at most of fabric.

wow those 3lbs must make up for the 80-100 hp the vr6 has over him...

..Took out back seats and panels also;) ....and the VR6 has 180 HP, well, atleast the GTI has that, and i assume their the same. so yea, its got like, 40-50 hp on me....w00t... my friend beats WRX's in strait a line with his 240sx, he only has some good suspension and a K&N filter on it, so yea, the jetta kicks the shit out of me on paper, but i kept up in real life.

i know it was a freak thing that I stayed with the VR6 as well as i did....infact it prolly wont' happen again, but truth of the matter is, is that i did :yes: ;) ....

you obviously have no concept of peak hp, hp through the curve, torque, tranny gearing etc...

my car easily has 60 more hp than you peak... but ALSO has hella lot more torque...

ill go to a 50 shot for arguments sake... my car with "only 50 more hp" would RAPE yoru car in a straight line..

Bwahaha.. This is to funny..

Dude, if you dropped 100lbs (which you probably didnt) you would only gain about a tenth of a second.

Opak, does your car get faster when you wash it? I hate to tell you man, but your Butt-O-meter is lying to you.

As far as racing is concerned. Ive seen a person in a 95 bone stock Civic LX beat a bone stock 98 V6 Mustang (by a car length), a modded 95 S-10 SS (by about 2 car lengths) and a few other things. Anything is possible, the drivers of the 2 cars couldnt drive for sh!t. Thats what we are trying to tell you! Your car is not a super car. You ran across some people that probably can drive, or didnt try all that hard. There are to many possibilities to suggest. We could sit here all day and toss them out.

Take your car to a track, and see how it does. Then we can talk about whats fast and whats not. Youll be lucky to see mid 16s would be my guess. Plus maybe you will find someone who really wants to "race" you.

seats 10-15 lbs AT MOST

panels OOOOOOHHHH wow... 3lbs..

get real dude your spare weighs more than ALL of the things you've listed...

50 hp is a SHITLOAD.... what rpm is the vw figure at... I'm guessing it's LOW like 3-4k at most... those things have TONS of lowend torque... since you posted a question I'll explain...

Hp= torque x rpm

the reason you have 127 hp is because it revs to 7200 rpm... your peak is around 6800 because after there are much higher parasitic draw on power due to rotating mass and weight of moving components...

here's yours sort of... this is the 1.7 (probobly has more torque than you)

• Engine Type Gas I4
• Displacement 1.7L/102
• Fuel System MPFI
• SAE Net Horsepower @ RPM 127 @ 6300
• SAE Net Torque @ RPM 114 @ 4800

that's about .018 ft/lbs per rpm...

the reason the vw has 180-210 is because it has TONS of lowend torque..

• Engine Type Gas V6
• Displacement 2.8L/170.3
• Fuel System SMPI
• SAE Net Horsepower @ RPM 200 @ 6200
• SAE Net Torque @ RPM 195 @ 3200

That's about .032 ft/lbs per rpm...

Just to make this easy here are BOTH of your hp readings at a givin rpm...

RPM..... YOU..... HIM....

1000 18hp 32hp
2000 32 64
3000 54 96
4000 72 128 at 4k he is already OVER you peak.
5000 90 160
6000 108 192
7000 126 224

So ya if you were in second flooring it and he was in 5th at half throttle you should have a GOOD chance of a repeat win...

still wanna bet cars... I'll pay for your gas to get it to me.

the jetta has more torque at 3200 rpm then you have PEAK WITH NITROUS....

if this doesn't explain to you why your car would ALWAYS lose to this car then I give up... great job dude sweet kill... I ROASTED a 300zx tt yesterday... cuz there was a 90 yearold driving it and she wasn't racing...

PRAISE THE CIVIC GODS

haha.. Maths probably a little off, but nice try anyhow. Most cars Peak before redline then drop a little in HP.

the math is right... it's just not taking into consideration the parasitic loss at higher rpms... it's just a simple use of hp= torque X rpm... which is a more than valid equation...

the reason the numbers are a LITTLE screwy is because I rounded to thousandths...

but overall that is a VERY accurate display of the hp of both engines through the rpm range. at most it's +/- 3hp. the upper and lower numbers are a little off due to mechanical loss differences...

Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

now wtf if YOU WERE RACING A 1/4 MILE FROM A 2 gear roll AND THE OTHER GUY was trying with a vehicle with roughly the same performance as you, then why the **** is it that you slowed enough for him to catch up after a 1/4 mile race and started in the same gear you were originally in

Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

Cause I was going 60, and he was about 4 cars back, and then slammed on the brakes down to about 45, and if you drove a civic, then you'd know that its perfect pulling power in second for racing, but you wouldn't know that, cause you don't have a honda...so why are you here?
:rolleyes:

Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

so basically your bragging about beating a jetta racing from a 2nd gear roll until 60mph? was it a 40-60 race? BY 4 CARS????

or maybe you raced him from a dead stop and run high 19's in the 1/4 mile?

i HAVE driven multiple civics and acuras considering i worked at a dealership for a bit, and also drove my freinds 94 ex and it still doesnt change the fact your an idiot with little automotive knowledge that makes up little fantasy stories does it?

please stop now and admit defeat

motha ****a says hes beat a jetta vr6 in a civic ex by 4 cars from a 2nd gear roll until 60mph and I dont know what im talking about right?:rolleyes:

no you have your head up your butt... he's a genius... he's getting a spoon engine to boost...

???

Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

on ANY day id pick the ford guy to stay OVER you... id have to say hes a MUCH larger asset to this HONDA forum than YOU...

so i ask.. we all hate you.. why are YOU still here..

he just once again pointing out how stupid opak is...

^ ya I figured you might not get that...

spoon engines are built for na roadracing... he wants to spend 8k for one then have a local shop take it apart and put in parts to make it suitable for boost.... ie pulling out ALL the spoon components and losing the most important part of a spoon engine... it was ASSEMBLED AND SPECED BY SPOON.


seriously opak your just making a fool of yourself at this point.

Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

OMG, you fuking idiot....you try to know what the hell you're talking about, but you weren't there....and its really funny.:D

i went only to 60, because i looked in my rear view, and he wasn't comin....and i knew it wasn't because my car was faster...so i slowed it down...got it, mister i know it all even tho i wasn't there?

No, you're jsut a fuking idiot in general, stop talking now, thnx.

HAHAHA, yea, that was just a fricken Idea...then i learned more about spoon...you obviousely weren't too much help...if you havn't seen my threads on rebuilding a b18c1 and then boosting, stop talking...this is what i'm thinking of doing now that i know about what certain engines are for...ie spoon, b18c5.

Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

How is he much more of an asset? ....just cause he's good at flaming on threads?

I fricken posted a fun race i had, and you two jumped all over me....now tell me...how is that being an asset?

So if someone posted a thread about them beating a viper in there civic, and then they had a video to prove it, you wouldn't care right? you'd just go back to your specifications that say its impossible. if i had a video of me keeping up with the jetta, would you get off my fricken back? its almost worth it to get your unconstructive flaming ass off my back.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

he is a REAL automotive enthusiast, he does not post outlandish stories, and babble about rediculous motor combos that would not work well.. he does not come on here seeking attention, fabricating lies.. talkign abotu his "shop sponsor" who has no clue who he even is..

^yup...

you have come here and done nothing but ask retarded questions and make retarded statements... that's fine if your "trying to learn" but you're not... you just come here spit out whatever bs idea you heard about or popped into your head... then we have to spend 3days telling you why your head is up your ass...

You have the audacity to laugh a ford guy for not being able to decode my VERY honda specific joke (about YOU)... when YOU are the dumbass who actually wanted to buy and dis-assemble a spoon engine... You're a class a moron.

If you had a video of you "keeping up" with a vr6 I would laugh at how bad of a driver the vr6 has in it... YOU HAVE NOO NOO NOOOOOOOOO mods that would enable you to hang with a vr6.. on video or not it's bs... OH and fyi... I've heard from SEVERAL people that that is EXACTLY the case with the "civic vs viper" video... the guy in the viper wasn't running it as hard or well as it could've been.

So no your story your expererience and your inability to realize that it's all a 1 time thing is retarded and full of sh!t.

I seriously have tried DESPERATELY not to rag on you cuz you're learning... but it's rediculous what a schmuck you represent yourself as... whether that's how you actually are or not I don't know or really care...

You should really show some respect to people who CONTRIBUTE to the board... not just fill it with retarded questions and reluctance to learn... even when ALL of the posts besides your's and your friend's were in total concurrence that your story is missing something... like a luded up cop half-ass driving his vr6.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

Never said OPAK sponsered me...speaking of fabrication...

How did ford50forlife start learning about cars? well, i can tell ya fer sure that it wasn't peopel like you that helped him learn, you fuking jackass. So a b18c1 rebuilt with a turbo boosting 14psi, and some other strenghthening items on the car aswell, is an outragious motor combo? I simple asked about turboing a spoon motor, and got a strait answer that the compression was too high, because its meant to be more of an auto-x motor...and i think even nonuv told me that :yes: .

ya know, i'm prolly not even gunna ever be able to show you guys the race, so why do i even try to argue with you, tis pointless, jsut spiuing(sp) out your facts and numbers....i know how fast my car is, and i guess to you, it isn't that fast...maybe your car is just extremely slow for a civ. i dunno....but it was you that started this flame war, because you and your facts....so don't go blaming the shit on this post on me....its all oyu, in fact you're the one that posted the first flame....so who is it now thats contributing and is an asset...? yea, k....its definately not you...in this situation atleast....in others you've been VERY helpful to me.

So we've accomplished that my car can't beat a vr6, but i did keep up, so we've decided that the driver of the vr6 can't drive...k, so why are you still fighting? both of you should just be quiet, and know when to shut up, seriousely. i told na innocent kill story, like everyone does here, and got in this phatty of a fight because soemone wasn't there and couldnt' see what really happened? thats BS.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

easy, start working on them for one and 2 spend 17,000 dollars to go to a automotive technical school and get a degree and enter the field of a mechanic....

for the most part people on this board have really enlightened me as to the world of hondas and i hope ive educated them likewise in certain threads, i originally came on this thread to ask svt cobra to race me in his old cobra, then i posted a couple races especially the one about me vs. the del sol with a gsr motor boosting... and i got a respect for the underdog and have stuck around since

which brings me to my next question why ARE YOU HERE?

you flame me for calling bs on a race i wasnt there and i can respect that, BUT THEN GIVE ME ALL THE DETAILS OF THE RACE (i.e. the race being a 2nd gear rolling start to 60mph race) and flame me when i bring up facts THAT YOU FREAKING SAID


just like the arguement you made with me about the SPOILER giving your REAR end downforce, AND The arguement about spiralmax giving dyno proven numbers (which you didnt even know about a dyno at the time), AND thirdly about the TURBO saturn thread where you HEARD HIS HEADERS on his turbo car

IT IS SAFE TO SAY that you need to shut the f#ck up because you are uniformed about how a car works, and really need to just accept defeat IN ITS RAWEST FORM

as for OC and nonovirbiz... i appreciate that....

btw nono, when you gonna let me take a crack at that civic with the 4.0;)

DUDE.... there's a HUGE honda/vw meet at marcus dairy next sat... the 31st... You show up I will run you... I got a wicked gay green coupe... with both fenders dented... and a chipped to hell hood.. you won't be able to miss me amungst the "big money" honda's.

thats cool i just got back from a bootleg party where i fought this kid in a red integra ;)... his name is precisiontuning lol

he drives a milano red 94 5 spd ls he said he set something up in danbury @ that date and he knows you lol, we fought after he got pissed i knew more about hondas than he did and that i beat him @ burnout for gamecube after 7 beers lol and i put him in a headlock roflmao

ill be there, if my car isnt done by then, then the 4.0 will be there.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

So a spoiler doesn't give you downforce? ....especially mine? hows that work?

I never said it gave me Dyno proven numbers...and i never said i heard his headers, i said i heard his intake....and i was guessing that it was a turo saturn...get your facts strait

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

thats funny you made a whole thread about meeting the guy and looking under his hood.. i guess that was all a lie then

the red saturn i raced

about the wing, it does give you rear downforce which doesnt help you in the least, and actually hinders you (ever so slighlty not even noticeable, kinda like a bowling ball on your trunk) but its the fact you were so persistant about it keeping your rear planted as if you had a 550hp rwd vehicle that actually had to worry about traction loss @ 60 plus that i laugh at.

ive learned argueing with you is a lost cause.... there is no end to it until the other party stops... whether it resorts in the basic of name calling or whatever. i dont feel like turning this thread into the other comedies youve made, so consider me doing you a favor and stopping it now to save you some face;)

oh and fyi opak you can't run an intake on a turbo either... well you can you just won't hear it...

the intake makes noise because it's an open realatively unbent un muffled pipe going into your engine (where the noise comes from) even if you run a cai on a turbo you'll NEVER hear it because it runs through the turbo... the turbo piping and most times an intercooler... it's a sealed system so you never hear the "roar" associated with cai's

ford5's summed up why there would not be header on there... those are the 2 main mods that are incompatable between fi and na.

P.S. In my opinion a 1.9 would have one... Idon't doubt you coulda won but if it was stick and they were competent they should have you with or without turbo...

again not trying to be mean but you don't seem to realize some "kills" aren't worth posting cuz they'd never repeat.

beating faster cars in a civic is only cool when it's because of work you've done and actually repeatable.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New Jetta vs. Civic EX
 

Did i say i looked under the hood of the saturn? nope. he said he had it....and i don't know if i believe him...therefore i am guessing when i say, its turbo charged.

i never argued that the wing was extremely useful to my car, but it does give me downforce, weather its bad DF or good DF.