The time has come.... Need a new computer...

[Addict]

Well I'm finally mad enough at my computer to buy a new one. The motherboard is bad & the memory may very well be there too. The on board RAID controller is dying. And a huge list of other things. Anyhow.

So I need a new system. Of course I'll be building my own. Where do you guys get parts at? The best place I've found so far is www.newegg.com. Any other places?

What kind of setups are you guys running? I doubt I'll go AMD because of their notorious heat issues. Plus I like to overclock as well.

[mt.biker]

what are you working with founds wise and what do you need this computer to do?

[slowEJ6]

AMD > Pentium

i went with newegg.com for all my parts. www.pricewatch.com is alright.

AMD Athlon XP1800+
512MB PC2100 Crucial Ram
MSI KT3 Ultra mobo
Abit Siluro GF4 MX440 vid card - swapping out for a Ti4600 when the funds are available.
Maxtor 40GB 7200rpm Super-Quiet hdd

as for heat issues, i dont have any issues with my setup at all. stable 43C with no extra fans - just the retail heatsink/fan right now.
when gaming the temps go up to about 48C, nothing bad cuz i know people whose setups are running hotter than that @ idle w/o even being overclocked.
im going to be adding a hdd cooler in the near future and upgrade the heatsink/fan - and get a couple quiet case fans - just to keep things even cooler w/o sacrificing too much quietness.

[ChrisCantSkate]

how do you guys check temp?

[Addict]

Originally posted by mt.biker
what are you working with founds wise and what do you need this computer to do?
Needs to be a powerhouse. I program & game alot. Little but of Phot editing.
Funds? Apparently Bank of America has instilled trust in me to spend their money. Hehe. Well ok so its a CC. Not like I have to pay them back or anything.:paranoid:

The heat issues with AMD.... They don't stop working when they overheat. AMD will literally flame up. Intel on the other hand will lock up & shut down.

[Addict]

Originally posted by 4thGenlude
how do you guys check temp?
The motherboard has to have onboard sensors.
Motherboard Monitor (http://mbm.livewiredev.com/)
That will monitor the temps.

[Addict]

Here's the lineup so far....
GeIL DDR RAM 512MB PC-3200 400Hz
$164.00

MSI Motherboard for Intel Processors Model 648 Max-L MS-6585-L (6585-020) RETAIL
$110.00

ENERMAX EG465P-VE(FM). 431W Power supply for AMD K7 & Pentium4
$82.00

Intel Pentium 4 2.4BGHz 512K 533MHz CPU Northwood P478 Processor Retail Box
$190.00

Seems like decent prices so far. $6 to ship. Not yet found a video card I like. I may stick with my Radeon 64MB DDR ViVo. Not sure.
*EDIT*
Changed mind on memory.

[94_AcCoRd_EX]

I've been really into the computer scene lately and I've built myself a couple. I got most of my stuff from NewEgg.

For the memory, corsair is testing to be one of the best right now. Will you be overclocking? I have a stick of Corsair XMS 3200-C2 (512MB), and its running@ 173 FSB at the fastest RAM timings with no problem. Performance is great.

For motherboards, I prefer Abit and Asus, but MSI should be fine.

The Enermax PSU is good. I have one of those and an Antec Tru Power 430, and both are nice.

If you're set on a P4, that's a fine chip, but I don't know that much about P4s.

The video card.... if you're not a hardcore gamer, a Ti4200 should be good. I got one of those to hold me over until they release their new line of cards next year.

A lot of this depends if you're planning on O/C'ing or not.

I learned a lot from www.overclockers.com forum, you might want to check it out.

[cstrom80]

If I were you I would wait a month or two. After a month or two, dual channel ddr i coming out so you can get a dual channel ddr motherboard that can support an 8x video card because the 8x vid card is coming out. As for processor... the Intel 1.6a is notorious for being overclocked to 3 ghz. Watch out for heat issues though. Gotta buy several extra fans. Go with somewhere that gives you a warranty offer. It's worth it in my opinion because, what if you buy it online and put it together yourself and something goes wrong.... you have to find the problem and basically replace the part which might cost you a lot more than if you had bought a computer from somewhere that had a warranty. If you do choose to put together your own pc, make sure you know what you are doing. Make sure you burn your computer in really well. My 2 cents.

[ebpda9]

i prefer pentium 4 too. after the experience with my old desktop i will say no to AMD's, even thou it was the shittiest one they ever made K6-2@500mhz. i kind of compare my laptop to other amd's with the same speed and i can say the laptops is as fast as those AMD desktops.

[Addict]

Well I hae plenty of PC experience (A+, Network+, HP, TOshiba & compaq certified) so building one is no issue.

I like the ABit boards myself. They haven't been nearly in the forefront as they had in the past. The MSI board has a better chipset than the ABIT & Asus boards I looked at. It should also be upgradable to the new HyperThreading technology from Intel. So that's why I chose MSI. It does have 8x AGP support already.

The 2.4B seems like a good deal. Dunno. I haven't really been in the P4 game much. I'm more of a dual P3 and overclock 'em person. ;)

Ever heard of GEiL memory? Seems like its decent stuff. The corsair is just too pricey. I was looking at the GEiL PC-3200 512MB DDR.

[94_AcCoRd_EX]

Originally posted by Civic_Addict

Ever heard of GEiL memory? Seems like its decent stuff. The corsair is just too pricey. I was looking at the GEiL PC-3200 512MB DDR.

Yeah, the Geil memory is pretty good, I just didn't know if you'd be pushing your computer the its limits.

[Addict]

Originally posted by 94_AcCoRd_EX
Yeah, the Geil memory is pretty good, I just didn't know if you'd be pushing your computer the its limits.
Oh I will. We'll see how this GeIL holds up...hehe:banana:

[Addict]

Well provided everything goes ok.... I should have it tomorrow. Yep. I'm that sucker that pays for the overnight & rush processing.:doh:
Enermax 431W(P4)ATXEG465P-VE(FM)RT 1 $82.00
MSI 648 MAX MS-6585-L 8X RTL 1 $110.00
CPU P4/2.4BGHz 533M 478PIN/512K RTL 1 $190.00
DDRAM 512MB 64MX64 PC-3200 GEIL RET 1 $164.00

It was all priced good. I looked around. Aside form the $1 or $2 I'd save on Pricewatch. :banghead:

[94_AcCoRd_EX]

Sweet, let us know how it runs :cigar:

[slowEJ6]

Originally posted by Civic_Addict
CPU P4/2.4BGHz 533M 478PIN/512K RTL 1 $190.00
:pukey

[Addict]

Originally posted by slow ej6
:pukey
Hey it outperforms AMD on every level. Thanks to 533MHz bus.

[slowEJ6]

$190 for that, no thanks.

[Addict]

Originally posted by slow ej6
$190 for that, no thanks.
Hmm. AMD's 2400 is $193. And it can't compare to the P4 2.4B. That's supposedly AMD's answer to it.

[slowEJ6]

2000 is down to like $100. overclock it. seems cool for the price imo compared to a P4. P4's are very overpriced.

[slowEJ6]

http://www.hardwarepub.net/reviews/processors/amdxp2000+/index.shtml :cool:

[slowEJ6]

http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q4/021001/index.html :eek:

[Addict]

Originally posted by slow ej6
http://www.hardwarepub.net/reviews/processors/amdxp2000+/index.shtml :cool:
That's a p4 1.6a vs a 2000+. Not identical processors. That & they overclocked them.

[Addict]

Originally posted by slow ej6
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q4/021001/index.html :eek:
Not out yet. By then you can bet Intel will have something for it.:rambo:

[drdingo21]

Originally posted by Civic_Addict
That's a p4 1.6a vs a 2000+. Not identical processors. That & they overclocked them. the xp2400 isn't as fast as the pentium 4 either. you were quick to say that pentium kills it. my xp1600 (1400) is faster then a p1700 and just barly under the 1800.

[Addict]

Originally posted by drdingo21
the xp2400 isn't as fast as the pentium 4 either. you were quick to say that pentium kills it. my xp1600 (1400) is faster then a p1700 and just barly under the 1800.
Read again. The 1.7 does not have the 533MHz FSB. That's what I was referring to. It only uses the 400MHz FSB. So yes, its not as quick.
http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q2/020506/p4b-06.html

[slowEJ6]

:D:D:D

[mt.biker]

anything over 1.5ghz is a joke.. dont waste your money mate

[slowEJ6]

a joke? hahahaha. a friend of mine has an AMD Thunderbird 1.2, my XP1800+ dominates that pile in every which way. its not much over 1.5 but, its a noticeable difference. and right now, even processors above 1.5 are CHEAP, why settle for something that is going to be outdated soon when you can get something better for a little more?

this AMD vs Pentium topic is never going to have an all out winner, they both outdo each other in different aspects, thats not going to change anytime soon.
i just like the fact that the newer pentiums dont destory themselves in a freak accident where the heatsink falls off. but oh well, i have NO problems with my AMD setup, and my next processor will be an AMD - AGAIN! :banana:

[94_AcCoRd_EX]

Originally posted by mt.biker
anything over 1.5ghz is a joke.. dont waste your money mate

I hope you were joking with this one.

[mt.biker]

lol the reality is that whatever you buy will be out of date in 6months, there will be something twice as fast as the thing you got. Save yourself the money and only buy what you need now. When your computer needs change then buy what you need.

No one really needs 2.5ghz they only think they do.

[94_AcCoRd_EX]

Originally posted by mt.biker
No one really needs 2.5ghz they only think they do.

I guess you don't 3d game or use high powered applications then. The extra power is needed. I don't think I need it, I know I do. I have/had several different computers of varying speeds, and the difference is noticable.

[Addict]

Originally posted by slow ej6
this AMD vs Pentium topic is never going to have an all out winner, they both outdo each other in different aspects, thats not going to change anytime soon.
Kinda like all the domestic vs. import stuff. :D

Originally posted by mt.biker
anything over 1.5ghz is a joke.. dont waste your money mate
Tsk tsk. it all depends on the purpose. For basic internet, word processing, etc a PII350 is fine. For games, multimedia, programming, get all the power you can afford.

Originally posted by 94_AcCoRd_EX
I guess you don't 3d game or use high powered applications then. The extra power is needed. I don't think I need it, I know I do. I have/had several different computers of varying speeds, and the difference is noticable.
Yep. I have a DNS/Web/Terminal server that's a PII550 w/768MB RAM. Works great. Now try & play Unreal, Quake or Counter-Strike on that. Heh. Its a joke.

[slowEJ6]

Originally posted by mt.biker
lol the reality is that whatever you buy will be out of date in 6months, there will be something twice as fast as the thing you got. Save yourself the money and only buy what you need now. When your computer needs change then buy what you need.

No one really needs 2.5ghz they only think they do.

or buy something better NOW for a little more money, then in 6months, overclock it to better specs.....
buying a computer every 6 months doesnt sound cost effective, at all.

and it wont really be outdated in 6 months, yes much faster components will be out but the majority of software will still be very useful on your system.....
and as was stated....if you dont game or use graphics programs - then you dont really need a high end comp to just browse the net - i want my games blazing fast and crystal clear, i want the sound to only make the graphics even more appealing and i want my computer fast and able to handle everything im throwing at it.
case in point....my friends 1.2 is slow as dog crap compared to my 1800+. programs load MUCH faster on my comp, my comp starts up faster, games play better on my comp, games LOOK better on my comp, i can browse the net and work in photoshop while defragging - yes its a little lagged but its not nearly as bad as his whereas it takes dialup times for things to load - he has dsl but his comp is so swamped with things to do.
hes had his setup for over a year though, but its a thunderbird, it was never fantastic to begin with.

[Maxvla]

i'm too late :no:

abit always for p4's (TH7II is like 95 bucks)
2.26b woulda been a better choice (but the 2.4b is not far from it)

the most important part of getting a p4 is getting RDRAM... !

i made the DDR mistake and i am handicapped by it. i want to change my setup to Rdram, but i need a bit more money before that can happen.

2x256mb Samsung pc800 woulda been perfect for ya.

[Maxvla]

Originally posted by slow ej6
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q4/021001/index.html :eek:
too bad my 1.6a @ 2664mhz would stomp that xp2000+ into an early grave.

plus the memory scores are WAY off for the p4s. even with DDR i'm getting 3,100mb/s. Rdram scores are upwards of 3700-4000mb/s

those charts showed like 2,000 or less so i completely disregarded all of their opinions.

[Maxvla]

Originally posted by cstrom80
If I were you I would wait a month or two. After a month or two, dual channel ddr i coming out so you can get a dual channel ddr motherboard that can support an 8x video card because the 8x vid card is coming out. As for processor... the Intel 1.6a is notorious for being overclocked to 3 ghz. Watch out for heat issues though. Gotta buy several extra fans. Go with somewhere that gives you a warranty offer. It's worth it in my opinion because, what if you buy it online and put it together yourself and something goes wrong.... you have to find the problem and basically replace the part which might cost you a lot more than if you had bought a computer from somewhere that had a warranty. If you do choose to put together your own pc, make sure you know what you are doing. Make sure you burn your computer in really well. My 2 cents.
dual ddr is actually quite some time off. and its the motherboard people that are slowing down the works. specifically getting the chipsets to work properly.

8x agp so far hasn't shown much if any improvement. so its not really something worth upgrading for.

how many 1.6a's do you see at 3ghz? not too many really unless you have promethia cooling or some other exotic cooling setup.

i'm running at 2664mhz on my 1.6a with the good old stock intel heatsink and fan. (slightly modified to run the fan at full speed)

also... the warranty situation... unless its specifically a no questions asked, no reason at all return policy you should not return products that you toast due to overclocking. you should take responsibility for your actions.

burning in is not something that needs to be done anymore. while it might help some people it doesn't really do anything for the newest gear.

[Addict]

Originally posted by Maxvla
i'm too late :no:

abit always for p4's (TH7II is like 95 bucks)
2.26b woulda been a better choice (but the 2.4b is not far from it)

the most important part of getting a p4 is getting RDRAM... !

i made the DDR mistake and i am handicapped by it. i want to change my setup to Rdram, but i need a bit more money before that can happen.

2x256mb Samsung pc800 woulda been perfect for ya.
I love Abit boards. that's actually what I'm replacing. However for the price, the MSI board will work. At least until Abit gets a P4 board out that I like. Thought the IT7 series shows some serious potential.

One of the issues that deterred me from Rambus is the company, Rambus Inc. They are really bad about licensing their product. Not to mention its still pricey for a statndard that only Intel uses.

I didn't want to get stuck with proprietary hardware.

[94_AcCoRd_EX]

Originally posted by Maxvla
burning in is not something that needs to be done anymore. while it might help some people it doesn't really do anything for the newest gear.

I'm not totally sure I agree. On one of my rigs, I stuck my XP 1600+ in, and couldn't O/C it far at all. I cranked up the voltages, and still couldn't get past 150ish FSB. I left the voltages up, ran Prime for a day or so, and I could push it much farther. After doing that, I could return the voltages down to stock and still push for 173FSB. I haven't tried any higher, but I'm totally stable right now @ ~1830MHz.

[slowEJ6]

im doin just fine with my 1800+ @ stock specs.....my video card has a major glitching problem so i dont increase the speed of anything right now - when i can afford to run this system w/c'd (because i like quiet) and get a video card that doesnt seem to have conflicting problems with my MSI mobo - ill OC. but until then, im playing games, listening to music, using 3d software and graphics programs juuuuust fine :yes:

[Maxvla]

Originally posted by 94_AcCoRd_EX
I'm not totally sure I agree. On one of my rigs, I stuck my XP 1600+ in, and couldn't O/C it far at all. I cranked up the voltages, and still couldn't get past 150ish FSB. I left the voltages up, ran Prime for a day or so, and I could push it much farther. After doing that, I could return the voltages down to stock and still push for 173FSB. I haven't tried any higher, but I'm totally stable right now @ ~1830MHz.
maybe its still something AMD's need to do. p4's seem to be at their best fresh off the line.

memory definately doesn't show much if any improvement from burning in. the day i got my ddr it went 210mhz. 3 months later... still 210mhz.